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10234. judithathome - 4/12/2012 5:06:42 PM You certainly have a cavalier attitude toward a young man's death. 10235. Jenerator - 4/12/2012 9:25:48 PM I don't know enough about the Zimmerman/Martin incident to fully establish my beliefs on what happened. There has been too much editorializing in the media. I want the facts.
I wish Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would butt out. I can't stand them. 10236. vonKreedon - 4/12/2012 9:29:21 PM I do wish that people would resist reflexive public posturing rather than being curious and insisting on getting their curiosty answered. At the outset it was pretty apparent that the police/DA's office simply dropping the matter was unexceptable. But what actually happened was not at all clear, which is why not having an investigation is inexcusable. 10237. Jenerator - 4/12/2012 9:31:37 PM Who's claiming there has been no investigation? 10238. vonKreedon - 4/12/2012 9:40:50 PM At the outset, before the hullabaloo, the case wasn't even being opened. My understanding is that there was no forensic team involvement and no canvassing of the neighborhood. Because of this , at least in part, we have little and conflicting understanding of what happened that resulted in Martin being killed by Zimmerman. 10239. OhioSTOPAS - 4/12/2012 9:53:01 PM In an affidavit filed today, the prosecution specifically alleges that the shouting/screaming heard on the 911 call just before the fatal shot was Trayvon Martin's voice. The only supporting evidence cited is that Trayvon's mother identified the voice, which is probative but not conclusive.
I expect that an expert or experts will try to more conclusively identify what can be heard on the call, but if it is Trayvon's pleading voice I wouldn't think Zimmerman could successfully claim self-defense or "stand your ground."
As Jen says, we need the facts to be established. And as VK says, that process is finally under way. 10240. arkymalarky - 4/12/2012 10:27:56 PM An unarmed boy was followed without reason and shot. An arrest and investigation should have been automatic. 10241. vonKreedon - 4/12/2012 10:38:02 PM Arky - We don't know if he was shot without reason, we also don't know who initiated the physical confrontation. There should have been a homicide investigation because one person was killed by another, the investigation might or might not have resulted in charges. 10242. arkymalarky - 4/12/2012 10:50:01 PM I said he was followed without reason. Unless being a black teen boy is a rrason. 10243. arkymalarky - 4/12/2012 10:52:15 PM And I said an arrest, not charges. 10244. vonKreedon - 4/12/2012 11:24:23 PM Oops, my bad. Thanks for the correction. 10245. arkymalarky - 4/12/2012 11:42:01 PM And love or hate Sharpton, nothing was happening until he got on it. That's what activism is all about. 10246. arkymalarky - 4/12/2012 11:43:01 PM That was in resppnse to Jen's post. 10247. Wombat - 4/13/2012 1:07:10 AM Arky,
Sharpton and Jackson jumped on the bandwagon. The protests had already begun and were taking root. 10248. arkymalarky - 4/13/2012 2:03:43 AM Actually the Martin family called Sharpton and requested his help. I don't know about Jackson. I haven't seen much of him. 10249. iiibbb - 4/13/2012 2:18:38 AM I think they're going to have a hard time proving 2nd degree murder... especially Florida's definition. Manslaughter seems the more provable charge.
At any rate. It is playing out much as I guessed. Zimmerman hung himself when he exited the vehicle, pursued someone alone, in the dark, in the rain.
I don't see how SYG defense is going to hold based on what facts have been shown to date.
It was a bad shoot. People on the firearm site I have frequented (more in the pass) have rallied a bit behind Zimmerman now but I think it's a vocal minority. There seem to be a bunch of people questioning Zim's actions because they recognize defending a bad shoot undermines their rights. 10250. iiibbb - 4/18/2012 6:20:44 PM Harold Fish
I wouldn't have done what Zimmerman did - he was a fool to get out of the car, follow a stranger with unknown motives, alone...
...but I could totally see myself doing something similar what Harold Fish did - Fish was far more justified in my opinion, was still convicted of 2nd degree murder, spent 3 years in jail and spent a butt-load to get out, and was eventually acquitted.
Z-man has a tough row to hoe. 10251. judithathome - 4/18/2012 7:29:25 PM Switch the roles in this and tell me that if it had been Trayvon with the gun and Zimmerman ending up dead...do you think there would have been an investigation?
Damned skippy there would have.
This police department had a history of letting white crime slide in regard to black victims. Just sayin'.
10252. iiibbb - 4/18/2012 7:40:24 PM The police bungling/racism regarding the case is independent of the technicalities of Zimmerman's foolishness.
I think the police dept was negligent if not racist.
I don't actually think Zimmerman is an outright racist - or in the heat of this moment was a racist - I happen to think he would have followed/shot any teen. He was just a gung-ho cop wanna-be.
10253. concerned - 4/18/2012 8:08:16 PM Notably absent in any recounting I have seen of this is where exactly the deadly altercation occurred. I suppose most of the drama would evaporate if it turned out that it happened right next to Zimmerman's van.
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