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10901. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 5:48:43 PM What does a transgender MMA practicioner's bone structure have to do with the rights of a 6 year old with different brain chemistry than a boy?
This may have everything with development in the womb and sensitivity or insensitivity to hormones
At the end of the day... who cares? It affects nobody. The fact that you attribute it on some scheme by the parents to convert one boy of a boy-transgender-girl triplet group is really bizarre.
I know enough people to know it's not about choice. Just looking at the hoops a transgender has to go through it's obvious that no one would casually jump through them over some idle fantasy.
And at the end of the day, who is anyone to judge.
And as far as MMA goes... it's a little two-faced of them to have so many fighters getting Testosterone Replacement Therapy in MMA to say anything about how "natural" someone who has been under hormone therapy for 5 years.
But enough... if MMA is really the battleground you have chosen for whether someone's sexual identity is legitimate or not, you've lost already. 10902. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 6:24:16 PM iiibbb,
"What does a transgender MMA practicioner's bone structure have to do with the rights of a 6 year old with different brain chemistry than a boy?"
Perhaps you can't keep straight what you say, but aren't you the poster who started off this discussion by saying "It isn't about "choice"... it's about identity."
Just as the male mixed martial artist made a choice to fight as a woman, so the parents made a choice to see their six-year-old as a little girl rather than a little boy. They chose to identify "her" learning disability as a consequence of the school not identifying "her" as a little girl. (How did they come to that conclusion?) They chose to make a big deal out of which bathroom she used, even when an acceptable compromise was found.
And don't talk to me about the differences in brain waves between six-year-old girls and six-year-old boys. You have no clue what you're talking about. Nor do you have any idea what kind of brain waves this six-year-old transgender has. You're just making shit up.
The decision was all about bad parenting, politics, and interest groups. It had nothing to do with science.
"At the end of the day... who cares? It affects nobody."
There you go again - not listening. Apparently because you're too stupid to understand.
I just told you who it affected. Are you going to tell me that the hundreds of millions dollars to be earned in women's sports - more money than you will ever earn in your sorry little life - that it's inconsequential as to which gender earns it?
How about the college athletic scholarships that go to women? Does it not matter who they go to, either? Should we just give them to men who say they're women?
There are a lot of shady men who would love to go after those millions of dollars in women's sports, and get a free college education to boot, if given the chance. Even Renee Richards has called it a potential problem and "she" competed as a woman.
"And as far as MMA goes... it's a little two-faced of them to have so many fighters getting Testosterone Replacement Therapy in MMA to say anything about how "natural" someone who has been under hormone therapy for 5 years. "
The use of TRT in MMA is extremely controversial. It's already banned in some states and will probably be banned in most others in the next couple of years.
"But enough... if MMA is really the battleground you have chosen for whether someone's sexual identity is legitimate or not, you've lost already."
The topic was sports, of which MMA is but a small part. And given the large money and time and interest devoted to sports, I would say that your need to denigrate the topic shows you've lost already.
10903. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 6:35:01 PM Transgenders are biological mistakes. They have high levels of depression, substance abuse, and suicide rates, and many who have surgical procedures to change their sex come to regret their decision.
That has nothing to do with the pressures of living in the most tolerant society in world history. There's no society that can accommodate such a mistake - at least enough to overcome the biology.
Transgendered or not, that poor six-year-old kid is in for a world of hurt. If this is just a phase he's going through, then his parents have abused him horribly. If he's truly a transgender, he's still has to deal with the consequences of being a mistake. 10904. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 7:24:38 PM So this six year old is gunning for a woman's spot in highly lucrative womens' sports? Really... that's why they do it?
I was just thinking that all of these women's sports are already awash with the current crop of transgenders.
If you are telling me that Transgenders are biological mistakes, you're already conceding that it's nature... there is no reason to force them to live any other kind of life than the one their brain is wired for. Deaf people are biological mistakes. Blind people are biological mistakes. Putting up obstacles above and beyond the ones they're already going to face in life isn't something we should bother ourselves with. This person is going to present herself female for the rest of her life probably... under the guidance of her parents, and medical professionals. By the time she's 18 and has take hormones and had a female puberty I guarantee she's not going to have any sort of male bone structure other than her pelvis. 10905. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 7:25:07 PM And you can attack my credibility all you want... this is the internet... your credentials are the equal to mine. 10906. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 7:29:49 PM And man... you really jumped into the personal attacks pretty quick for a board that is traditionally pretty civil among those who disagree.
Stupid?
No, I just think the societal tilt against GLBT persons is stupid. Let people live their lives. Love who they want. Whatever. It is an absolute waste of energy to try to make these people's lives difficult.
So I hope the SCOTUS starts to push the wall down with a pro gay marriage ruling. 10907. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 7:46:03 PM No... I've thought about it.
It isn't about choice. It is about identity. You may disagree with me, but the fact of the matter is that no matter what you say about them, they're identity is theirs and there isn't a whole lot you're going to do to change it. You may repress it... but you won't change someone's nature.
Like what if one day people weren't allowed to be assholes anymore. You would be in trouble Pincer... you'd want speak your mind but someone would be there to swat you on the ear and tell you to shut the fuck up.
That would probably get on your nerves after a while... but it wouldn't cure you of being an asshole. 10908. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:01:22 PM "So this six year old is gunning for a woman's spot in highly lucrative womens' sports? Really... that's why they do it?"
No, but they could be doing it for attention - just as the bubble boy's parents used their kids for attention.
I see family visits to Oprah, Ellen, and The View - and anywhere else double-digit IQ women gather in order to bolster each other's stupidity. Then comes the million-dollar book deal. Then more talk shows. Then a visit to the White House, where Obama can shine a beatific smile down on the blessed lad as he tells the family it's okay for their little boy to be a girl.
Then ten years down the road, after the little boy becomes a young man, he can do the talk shows again, but this time to talk about what a fucking mistake his parents made. Then another book deal and more talk shows. Perhaps by then, we'll have a more conservative president in the White House who can tell the former six-year-old transgender that it's okay for him to not want to be a little girl.
"I was just thinking that all of these women's sports are already awash with the current crop of transgenders."
No, they're not. Not yet. But they soon will be. There are enough guys out there with moderate athletic ability who, with the right incentives, might feel the desire to branch out. Perhaps for money, attention, or because they're just bored with life. And real women athletes, like Rondy Rousey, are right to be pissed off about it.
But I guess this shows that women's athletics - and Title IX, which led to their expansion - were always a joke. You can see that the women here don't care about athletic competition, which is what most of us men suspected from the beginning. You wanted attention, not a level platform for athletic competition.
"If you are telling me that Transgenders are biological mistakes, you're already conceding that it's nature... there is no reason to force them to live any other kind of life than the one their brain is wired for."
What they want to do, and what they are, are two entirely different things. The ambiguity is usually easy to settle on biological grounds, but it's never easy to settle on psychological grounds - which is why you get men who want to be women and then are still not happy when they go under the knife because no amount of surgery and dress-up and social acceptance can make a mistake happy.
It's like being born without any arms and legs. Or with two heads. The condition itself is not conducive to happiness. 10909. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:03:59 PM "And you can attack my credibility all you want... this is the internet... your credentials are the equal to mine."
I don't give a shit about credentials, or whether you're an asshole or not.
I only care about the quality of your arguments. And yours are lacking. 10910. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 8:29:57 PM Actually yours is lacking. The court, after all, agrees with me asshole. Fallen Fox fights as a woman, asshole.
You are just an asshole, asshole. 10911. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 8:33:03 PM The ship has sailed. I'm only agreeing with the result, and inevitable results.
You are the incoherent transient jibber-jabbering about how the world doesn't fit your reality.
Go find a bridge before the other trolls get them all. 10912. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:37:57 PM Citing the court's decision is an appeal to authority. It's not an argument, you dumbass. Judges are not scientists. They can, and usually do, make their rulings for all kinds of reasons that have nothing to do with science. They also can misuse science.
"Fallen Fox fights as a woman, asshole."
Yes, "she" does. And the Olympic Committee has also ruled in a similar fashion. That's because many international bodies are governed by the same sort of European and American nitwits that you rightly see as your ideological brethren. 10913. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:45:52 PM iiibbb,
"The ship has sailed. I'm only agreeing with the result, and inevitable results."
You can no more predict the future than you can study the crack of your ass without a mirror.
One possible future is that parents will have the ability to simply get rid of these genetic misfits before they are even born. By aborting them. Homosexuals and transgenders and babies with Down's Syndrome would then go the way of the old circus misfits who are removed from the population before they even enter it. 10914. judithathome - 6/25/2013 8:49:05 PM You can see that the women here don't care about athletic competition, which is what most of us men suspected from the beginning.
By "here", do you mean the Mote? 10915. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:51:09 PM Yes. 10916. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 8:51:20 PM Gooble, Goggle
10917. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 8:58:07 PM One possible future is that parents will have the ability to simply get rid of these genetic misfits before they are even born. By aborting them. Homosexuals and transgenders and babies with Down's Syndrome would then go the way of the old circus misfits who are removed from the population before they even enter it.
Wow...
just, wow...
you are a degenerate to boot. 10918. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 9:00:45 PM You would have me accept your authority? Fuck that. 10919. PincherMartin - 6/25/2013 9:02:20 PM Well, if you're a parent, would you want you kid growing up to be gay?
Of course not. If we can screen for gayness genetically, or if we discover that the condition is caused by a pathogen, then it will be pretty easy to remove it from the population.
And I suspect most parents of potentially gay children will want that. And even those who don't want it will be forced to deal with the consequences of a world in which gayness is a lot less prevalent than it is today. And so they, too, will be forced to join in the movement. 10920. iiibbb - 6/25/2013 9:18:05 PM I want both of my kids to be happy. I am not concerned if they are gay. I know, and am friends with, plenty of gay people. There are several gays close on my wife's side of the family.
I would not deny these people a damn thing. I don't consider them defective.
I think you are fucked up in your head.
And even if they found a in-vitro "cure" ... you suggest that the gays out there would or should be treated any less than humans? I sure hope your not suggesting that.
Whatever the cause, people are who they are. As long as they're not hurting anyone I've got nothing to say about that... and when you talk about the impact transgenders will have on female sports... you call me when that problem actually manifests itself. Fox isn't even that highly regarded as an MMA artist-- 3 rounds to take a 2-2 fighter is her best fight so far. Certainly Rhonda Rousey would kick her ass. And it's not unanimous in MMA either.. Jon Jones supports her"
And if you ask me... Joe Rogan... who objects to Fallon... has a little too many fantasies about being fucked by a big dude...
perhaps like you the idea of it hits too close to home?
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