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6929. clydefo - 4/12/2007 12:37:00 AM Yes thoughtful, I hope we're way past white bread.
...given the impact carbohydrates have on insulin and the damage insulin does to the body.
Insulin is a natural digestive hormone, not a poison. It prevents damage to the body by facilitating the production of a steady supply of clean fuel. A normal daily caloric intake on the Pritikin regimen never comes close to producing any "excess" insulin, no surges or spikes.
...What happens when we get too much fructose?
Pritikin advises that we avoid "too much" of anything, including water. Eating fruit and other CC food to satiety throughout the day is perfectly safe.
I suppose our main disagreement is over the desirable percentage of fat and protein calories. Looking at the nutrition chart recommendations for fatty acids and amino acids I'm confident I eat enough for my body's needs with little excess to get rid of. 6930. clydefo - 4/12/2007 5:38:14 AM Typical daily Pritikin fare: Protein grams.
One cup broccoli................4
One 6 inch ww pita bread...6
One cup oatmeal (dry).......13
Banana................................1
Two cups skim milk...........16
One cup pinto beans .........16
One cup sweet potato..........4
Total..................................60 grams
The RDA for protein for men is 60 grams. The other fruits and vegetables eaten through the day also contain some protein, so the beans can be every other day. Up to one pound of lean animal protein per week is o.k. but not needed as a source.
It's very easy to eat more than is needed because it's found in most all foods.
It's basically the same with fatty acids. Easy to get what we need for cell maintenance, metabolic chemistry, etc., from a variety of whole grains and vegetables. 6931. thoughtful - 4/12/2007 6:16:40 PM My comments:
1) clearly I think 60 g per day, especially for a man, is too low...double or triple that for my likes. Schwarzbein recommend 6-8 ozs protein a day for women, 8-12 for men
2) i don't know enough about all the required amino acids to know if you're hitting all of them in the diet as listed. I know only that rice and beans together and soy are complete proteins.
3) more power to you if you can stick to such a diet and find it satisfying. I never could. In order for any diet to be successful, it has to be one you can live with for the long term. That diet would leave me feeling hungry and deprived and my ability to stick with it would quickly drain.
In fact, the study that was posted way above that compared the success of the various diets found that none of the participants were faithful to the diet over the test period. So any diet that is too restrictive is likely to fail.
Let me share with you a typical day (for a man, portions of protein and carbs would be increased):
Bkfst: V8 juice, 2 eggs scrambled with sauteed peppers, onions, mushrooms, (using canola oil), whole grain english muffin with butter
Am Snack: handful of walnuts
Lunch: 2 ozs turkey on a slice of whole grain (reduced carb) bread with a slather of mayo, lettuce, and a carrot
Pm snack: 1 oz cheese with an apple
Dinner: Grilled pork chop, sweet potatoes, zucchini sauteed in olive oil with garlic and parmesan cheese and a tossed salad with vinagrette dressing
Approx total calories is about 1400 calories with a balance of protein, fats, carbs, nonstarchy vegetables and a balance of fats. This would be sufficient to lose weight. To maintain one's weight, carbs would be added.
6932. judithathome - 4/12/2007 6:49:12 PM Sounds like a plan to me!
I eat a handful of walnuts every day...very satisfying. 6933. clydefo - 4/12/2007 8:19:04 PM The RDA for protein has been established for years. Why haven't Nutritionists who challenge it been able to present enough evidence to get it changed? They would certainly have the meat and dairy lobbies behind them. The RDA was set at about twice what science shows is actually needed as as arbitrary "margin of error".
The acidity associated with excess protein consumption may cause calcium to leech from bone and contribute to osteoporosis. The nutritional jury isn't in on this, but why risk it if the extra amino acids aren't needed?
There are only so many "essential" fatty acids and all are provided by a Pritikin diet. Any more is "gravy". Nutritionists who recommend more from a variety of high-fat sources are not basing it on any scientific evidence. They only offer generalizations about "balance" and the "value of anti-oxidants", etc. You can OD on that stuff and upset the normal body chemistry. Fat is seductive. It adds richer taste, mouth-feel, etc. But one only needs what's in the whole wheat toast, not in the butter.
Low sodium V8 tastes as briny as seawater to me. 6934. thoughtful - 4/12/2007 9:14:02 PM Well, there is this article suggesting that extremely low fat diets (less than 25% fat) can put you at risk for heart disease if you are of a certain genetic type.
As I mentioned from personal experience, I did not do well on a low fat high carb diet and neither did my hubby. We both feel and do much better on our current diet. Interestingly, my cholesterol levels remain unchanged despite the diet change. Total is 208, but that's because my HDL, the good stuff is very high. My triglycerides are very low.
So I think an important element to keep in mind is individualized medicine. The main question is, in following this pritikin thing, how do you feel? how do you look? how do you sleep? and so on.
I think it's really important to listen to your body. It will let you know if what your doing is working, just like mine did with my low fat issues.
BTW, do you take any vitamin or other supplements? 6935. thoughtful - 4/12/2007 9:36:59 PM The jury is out on the impact of protein on bone. See this article which reviews several recently done studies and how contradictory their results are. Further this study suggests that with adequate calcium consumption, protein does not impact the bones.
6936. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 12:12:37 AM Well, back from my doctor's appt, and I have hypothyroidism. Explains a lot, and it's apparently something that sometimes happens to women after menopause. 6937. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 12:14:19 AM My mother has it as well, and my dad's doesn't work any more at all, so it's not all that surprising, though I wasn't thinking about it being a possibility.
And I'm typing this on my WildBlue internet using my new router.
When I get my meds, I should become as zippy as my computer. They have to do more bloodwork first. 6938. judithathome - 4/13/2007 12:17:41 AM Low sodium V8 tastes as briny as seawater to me.
Well, fresh tomatoes taste salty to me...do you think it's better to get 880mgs in the regulare V8 or to get 80mgs in the low salt V8? And I know you abhor juices but sometimes, people want the juice and I'd rather have the low salt V8 than the regular.
I'd be willing to put my numbers with regard to cholesterol, HDL, LDL, blood sugar, and my blood pressure up against yours anyday...and I will be 64 next month.
6939. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 3:57:45 AM I meant to mention that I also started my allergy shots back today. Now I get two (divided dose according to the allergy), one in each arm, and it's MUCH better. No more sore punk-knots and bruises. At least not until they start going up on the dosage. Between that and treating the thyroid issue, I'm hoping to feel LOTS better by the time I finish school at the end of June. I was on allergy shots for a year, and though they take a long time to work, they made my sinuses better than they've been since I moved to AR when I was 12. Now they're pretty much back like they were before I started the shots, which were the worst they'd been since I'd moved here. I also brought an air purifier to work and put one in my bedroom along with my dehumidifier, and that's helped a whole lot more than I thought it would.
If anyone has any personal knowledge or experience with hypothyroidism, I'm very interested. The rest of what I've been doing, especially diet-wise, is going well. I also understand why I could hardly do anything the first exercise day, though after my surgery (just two years ago today, which I wouldn't remember, but Mazie was born the day I had my hysterectomy) once I was able I could fairly easily do 30 minutes of exercise with the Basic Training tapes. And I did lose a pound. My doctor--who's great--said go ahead and exercise and change my diet, but I won't feel very good until I get the right dosage of meds. Bottom line, I'm going to keep plugging on the program without expecting to up my exercise until I get my thyroid under control, and look forward to feeling better than I have in years. The hysterectomy began that, the allergy shots continued it, and this will top it all off. I'm glad to finally know what's been causing me to not want to move for the last year or so, at least. I've always been something of a slug, but this past year has been very noticeably different, which I attributed to too heavy a school/work load.
Thoughtful, I know you have Graves disease, which causes the opposite (right?) wrt thyroid. Any other issues with that or ways of dealing with it? 6940. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 4:00:09 AM I meant I did lose a pound this week, not two years ago. Then I lost around 10 with surgery alone, and now I'm back to that pre-surgery weight (and look). 6941. betty - 4/13/2007 4:03:36 AM I have a friend who developed hypothyroid in her late 30's. Once it got treated things got better for her. This is probably good news. best with this. 6942. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 4:10:49 AM That's what my doctor said. Did I mention she's great?
You weren't posting when I posted here that my doctor, whom I'd gone to off and on since we moved to AR when I was 12, died suddenly of a heart attack at age 75 early this fall. This woman, a former math student of my husband's, was scheduled to work with him, and now she's the only doctor in the office. My doctor was fantastic, old-school, and knew me and all my fears and idiosyncracies so well. He agreed to deliver my daughter long after he'd quit delivering babies. I went into panic mode when he died, because I was under huge stress from graduate school and a full load at work, among other things. Now Mose and virtually all of Bob's family who lives here--including his mother, whose previous doctor sucked--goes to her. 6943. arkymalarky - 4/13/2007 4:12:42 AM Not to sound like a selfish clod, I cried when he died, too. Still do when I think about it. The first time I called for an appointment, several weeks later, I choked up on the phone, but so did his receptionist. 6944. concerned - 4/13/2007 5:57:18 AM I just took my first pill to control hypertension today (20mg lisinopril). In the doctor's office before it was prescribed, I measured 180/112. Several hours after I took it and ran 3 1/2 miles, I measured myself at 122/63. One pill, seven hours. 6945. clydefo - 4/13/2007 7:05:38 AM judithathome, I'm too smart to bet my fitness numbers against a swimmer. Average BP this evening, 117 / 70. Resting heart rate high 40's to low 50's. No cholesterol test in several years but last time the Doctor said it was just fine. 65 years old this Fall.
A few times a month I might mix a small glass of soda water/concord grape juice, or OJ, 50/50, to drink with a sandwich or salad, very rarely by itself. I would enjoy unsalted V8. Except for small amounts when cooking cornbread and beans, I avoid salt. I like the lighter stride and the leaner look now that I have acquired it in the past year.
thoughtful, I still have a shelf full of supplements but I've stopped buying them. I occasionally pop a D or folic acid or calcium tab on impulse "just in case", but also out of superstition. No more E and I've never taken A. I'm convinced they are needed only by people with diagnosed deficiencies.
With the daily exercise, low-fat blood and carrying 30 fewer pounds of fat and water I've never felt better and more energetic. I quit the beer and don't miss it. Insomnia totally gone.
My diet a year ago was similar to that in 6931, just a little too much of it. 6946. Ulgine Barrows - 4/13/2007 8:46:52 AM I am really liking the Isagenix grape flavor energy drink.
Tried a few brands... does anybody want to buy my leftover Advocare Spark?
Feeling fat & ugly, I dragged my sorry ass to the gym today. The steam room at the end of it all, felt great. 6947. Ulgine Barrows - 4/13/2007 9:02:07 AM ooopsie....6945. clydefo.........'too smart to bet my fitness numbers against a swimmer'
Almost forgot why I wanted to post here.
We made the kid take swimming Tues/Thurs because he was getting the man titties, at twelve. Ick, icky poo. That was back in January.
Well, that is all behind us. Tuesday there was bad weather and the 6th graders had to stay inside for recess. The boys did arm wrestling, and MY SON WON! Hee hee, they were chanting his name so loud the teacher made them all stop.
Also he has an uncle that was on a wrestling team who gave him tips on arm wrestling, but still....he is learning the benefits of regular exercise.
And yeah, I know it, too.
Just been lazy lately, but summertime pool time is approaching.
My son delights in lifting me up, now. He is almost taller than me. He looks so grown up, but he is only 12. Eight hairs on his chin - he was in a charitable mood when he let me count them.
We had a nap together with the cat a few days ago on the floor, these sort of days are numbered. I treasure them. 6948. Ulgine Barrows - 4/13/2007 9:20:55 AM I highly recommend a siesta/nap as part of any health routine.
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