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40400. wonkers2 - 11/21/2008 12:25:53 AM Thoughtful, I watched nearly the entire hearing yesterday and I didn't hear any of the CEOs say that they would not (or would) be willing to give up their company planes. I doubt the accuracy of that claim. GM has plants scattered all over the country and the world, some in locations not served by commercial airlines. Company planes are virtually a necessity. However, I agree they would have been better advised to fly coach to D.C. or at the very least travel together on one company plane. 40401. wonkers2 - 11/21/2008 12:28:08 AM I may have missed the alleged exchange on giving up company planes and will stand corrected if you can provide a reliable report. 40402. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2008 1:14:25 AM This is an extraordinary moment . . .
As my mother used to say: Many a dog will have his day . . . and live to regret it! 40403. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2008 1:19:37 AM 
40404. David Ehrenstein - 11/21/2008 1:44:52 AM Yes it's in your town now -- ALLENTOWN! (One of the most wildly homoerotic music videos ever made.) 40405. jexster - 11/21/2008 2:39:01 AM Sounds like a whisper 40406. arkymalarky - 11/21/2008 2:58:05 AM Can I stay and your house Arky"
Sure, if you want to drive the four plus hours from here to Eureka.
And you're wrong about the auto industry. It doesn't exist in a vacuum. Fire the CEOs and let gvt approve any replacement in charge of spending that money and make them the seat of the new green transportation revolution. 40407. jexster - 11/21/2008 3:05:29 AM I have no idea what the internals of the auto companies look like and neither does Paul Krugman
I don't trust them
Nancy says Wonkers must show her a plan before she shows him the money
40408. jexster - 11/21/2008 3:07:04 AM Nor do I trust Congress's ability to exercise financial due diligence and make a business like decision even if they had the information that I would require if I were an attorney advising a lender 40409. wonkers2 - 11/21/2008 3:12:34 AM The Cap'n sez, "Nancy'll have to show me more'n a plan before I show her my money." 40410. wonkers2 - 11/21/2008 3:17:24 AM My impression is that General Motors' net worth is negative if all liabilities are counted realistically. And it has been negative for some time taking into account pension and health care promises to employees and retirees. I'm sure the hole in the pension fund is bigger than the Grand Canyon. Even before the market crashed it wasn't fully funded as claimed. The FASB standard for fully funded assumes the company will continue to operate and make contributions as long as there are pensioners or employees who have been promised pensions. That's one of the flaws in defined benefit pension plans funded by a single company--most of the companies go broke or into bankruptcy or are acquired while there are remaining pension obligations. 40411. jexster - 11/21/2008 3:18:38 AM I am torn Arky
Which geek is hotter??????
Markos
Nate Silver
Eric Kleefeld
 40412. arkymalarky - 11/21/2008 3:53:02 AM Markos, hands down. Silver's comically geeky--he embraces geeky. And Kleefeld just gives me the willies. 40413. arkymalarky - 11/21/2008 3:54:09 AM And Markos has that irresistable Latin thing going on. 40414. jexster - 11/21/2008 3:59:27 AM Must see TV
Countdown...Palin interview while pardoning a turkey, a guy is slaughtering and draining blood just over her shoulder 40415. jexster - 11/21/2008 4:08:44 AM Show us the business plan before we show you the money
Somali pirates demand 25 million dollars for Saudi oil tanker 40416. jexster - 11/21/2008 4:20:51 AM 40391
Triple Jew score bitches! 40417. jexster - 11/21/2008 5:33:21 AM Arky take a good hard look at the clowns who you want to give 25 billion so they can hand it out to Wonkers crowd
Dana Milbank reports
"I drive the same '66 Plymouth Valiant that I've always had," Ackerman proffered. He went on to discuss a problem with the GPS system in his Cadillac. "I wanted a loaded car in blue; I had to reach out to five states to find one in blue," he complained.
It seemed everybody had a car story to tell. Rep. John Campbell (R-Calif.) let it be known that he was a car dealer for 25 years. Rep. Stephen Lynch (D-Mass.) disclosed that he had worked at the GM plant in Framingham. Rep. Donald Manzullo (R-Ill.) wanted to see more ads for the car made in his district, while Rep. Michael Capuano (D-Mass.) said the Edsel was once made in his home town. Rep. Walter Jones (R-N.C.) read from Cicero and held up photos of cars. And Rep. David Scott (D-Ga.) had no car stories to tell but delivered the surprising news that the problem with the Titanic was not its collision with an iceberg...
You go bail em out
Keep the Congress home40418. jexster - 11/21/2008 5:37:02 AM Detroit bail-out: a nation in denial
By Michael Moritz
FinancialTimes
Almost 30 years ago I reported for my first job in the Fisher Building in Detroit, a gilt-laden, art deco marvel conceived by Albert Kahn, which stood across the street from the headquarters of General Motors. Today, the Fisher Building remains but General Motors long ago decamped for a smaller perch near the Detroit River in a building whose mortgage is now being offloaded on to a destitute city. As a lackey in Time Magazine’s Detroit bureau, my assignment was to assume a plausible manner and tag along with my more senior colleagues while we reported on what, in retrospect, was the first convulsive death rattle of the US automobile industry. During the past few weeks, as the heads of the auto companies have started pleading for federal funds, I have found myself thinking about those long ago times. 40419. jexster - 11/21/2008 5:46:32 AM It is easy to point an accusatory finger at the unions. But anyone even dimly familiar with the manner in which company goon squads and spies once terrorised unrepresented auto-workers during the 1930s and 1940s would be hard-pressed to argue with the notion that the only companies that deserve a union obtain a union. As the years passed, as the unions became more entrenched and as their members’ sense of entitlement grew, so too did their demands. The length of grievances grew, the work week was whittled down, health and insurance benefits piled up and wildcat strikes became part of the daily rhythm. By the 1970s the estrangement between hourly employee and salaried manager had become almost as intense as it had been decades earlier, except now the shoe was on the other foot. The battle being fought was between the sense of entitlement on the factory floor and the air of self-satisfaction in the executive suites.
It is impossible to over-estimate the consequences of Detroit’s adversarial labour relations. This, far more than any wage difference, has spelled the difference between the success of the Japanese companies and the fate of their US counterparts...I am tempted to say it is the breakdown of a sense of decency – the mutual compact that should, in a better place, flow between all people who work for a company – but, sadly, that sentiment never existed in Detroit. Maybe it does in a muted fashion in the US factories belonging to Japanese companies that now employ more than 70,000 hourly workers. (By comparison, Chrysler now employs 33,000 US hourly workers compared to 165,000 in 1977).
A little too close to the bone for someone we know
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